Армения-Турция

[Alexandre Rodrigues]

вы противоречите сами себе. По-вашему в результате Азербайджан ничего не теряет, Армения если не выигрывает, то тоже ничего не теряет, а Турция тем более ничего не теряет. Так в чем проблематичность сделки по-вашему. Все просто супер.

Карабах у вас конечно есть, как дотационный регион Армении, не более. Если Армения завтра не сможет его кормить-пиши пропало. Если же НКР станет независимой, сможет сама делать хоть какие-то деньги.

И потом не забывайте, в каждой сделке должен быть копромис с каждой стороны.

Насчет Евросоюза, я так и не поняла , каким образом Евроконституция может помешать Европе быть ж*полизкой Америки? Во- первых этой общей конституции никогда не будет и политического единства у них не будет ( спасибо Польше), этот союз будет оставаться экономическим, на худой конец социальным, но никак не политическим.

[Monica B.]

Дорогой друг, зачем спорить, тем более , что например в своем первом абзаце вы написали то же самое, что написала я, только своими словами.

Даже умудрились поспорить о Карабахе , что он не дотационныи, он богат водными ресурсами, но не освоен. Так я и не говорила , что он дотационный по определению и другого не может быть . И я знаю, что говорю. Именно потому что не освоен в должной мере, является по сей день дотационным. Так , что термин ДОТАЦИОННЫЙ очень даже удобен в этом контексте. Не надо стесьняться.

[Monica B.]

а вопрос Геноцида с Арменией связан меньше всего, ибо признание его началось в 60-х годах, когда Армения ну ничего не могла предпринимать для этого. Здесь рулят диаспорщики. Если даже Армения всё простит, механизм уже в движении, и турки понимают , что словесными извинениями здесь не обойтись. Но даже словесные извинения, растиражиробанные во всех мировых СМИ большой плюс. потому что после этого Турция в принципе не сможет совершить никакой агрессии по отношению к Армении.

[Alexandre Rodrigues]

Распечатать

Интервью Day.Az с известным армянским политологом Александром Искандаряном.

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- В таком случае, что даст Армении открытие армяно-турецкой границы?

- Довольно многое. Из своих четырех соседей у Армении закрыты границы с двумя, так что открытие границы с одной из них имеет большое значение. Даже более того, тут дело не в арифметике, Турция - западная соседка Армении, через нее пролегает путь в Европу, гораздо более прямой и дешевый, нежели действующий ныне грузинско-черноморский. А основной торговый баланс у Армении именно с европейскими странами.

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[Monica B.]

кстсти, в Мюнхене функционирует Институт изучения армянского вопроса с 70-х годов. Естественно Армения не имела никакого отношения к его открытию- это лишь маленький пример.

[Alexandre Rodrigues]

Так , что термин ДОТАЦИОННЫЙ очень даже удобен в этом контексте. Не надо стесьняться.

[Alexandre Rodrigues]

Но даже словесные извинения, растиражиробанные во всех мировых СМИ большой плюс. потому что после этого Турция в принципе не сможет совершить никакой агрессии по отношению к Армении.

[Alexandre Rodrigues]

кстсти, в Мюнхене функционирует Институт изучения армянского вопроса с 70-х годов. Естественно Армения не имела никакого отношения к его открытию- это лишь маленький пример.

[Monica B.]

под дотациями я предполагаю газ, электроэнергию, средства на восстановление разрушенных в войне городов . Дотации- это не только еда в количестве , чтоб человек не умер с голоду. Причем тут военные. Или все , что я сейчас привела, Карабах получает от неба? Нет, он получает это от Армении. А получи он независимость, даже при небольших инвестициях , мог бы сам себя этим обеспечить и довести уровень жизни даже до отметки, выше , чем в Армении. И если Азербайджан в Карабахском вопросе лишится своего единственного по сути союзника- будет еще одним большим шагом на пути к независимости НКР. А эти ваши фактически свободен или нефактически оставьте для подростков.

[Monica B.]

Ну и что именно с этого времени туда приехали беженцы армяне из Ливана ! Всё логично Моника .

[Sari Galin]

ANALYSIS: Halacoglu Packs Up: What Does Yusuf Hoca's Departure Mean To Turks and Armenians?

By Khatchig Mouradian

From The Armenian Weekly

WATERTOWN--On July 23, Resmi Gazete (Official Gazette) announced that Yusuf Halacoglu, the head of the Turkish Historical Society (TTK) since Sept. 21, 1993, was dismissed from his position.

Halacoglu had become notorious following a number of issues that were highly publicized--at least in Turkey--like his denial of the Armenian Genocide in Switzerland and the investigation against him in that country; his debates with and challenges to genocide scholars Taner Akcam, David Gaunt, and Ara Sarafian; and, most recently, his $20 million offer to the ARF to open its archives here in Watertown (better known in the Turkish media as the “Boston archives”).

For years, progressive Turkish scholars have urged Ankara to replace Halacoglu. In off-the-record interviews I conducted on July 23, several of these scholars said they were very happy with the decision.

According to the Turkish daily newspaper Hurriyet, Halacoglu--who is called Yusuf hoca (teacher) by many in the TTK--said he is currently on vacation (in Bodrum) and the developments took place without his prior knowledge. Halacoglu added, “This is something that can happen any time. One of the Seyhulislams [a title of superior authority on Islam] says, %u218We are people who are used to pack up and be on our way. We can go anywhere anytime.' I believe the same. Today you do this duty for the state; tomorrow you continue as a scientist. These are normal things. I perceive these things as normal.”

Turkish commentators and political analysts I talked to generally agreed that Halacoglu's contract was terminated because the ruling Justice and Development Party (AKP) wanted to appoint someone close to the AKP. Halacoglu was very close to the Nationalist Movement Party (MHP), an ultra-nationalist party that has 71 seats in the Turkish parliament. According to some sources, his ties to what is known as the “Deep State” in Turkey may have contributed to the decision of not renewing his yearly contract as well.

It is also likely that the AKP was not happy with the extreme radical and confrontational course Halacoglu had taken on the Armenian Genocide and the Kurdish issue. Whether this signals a change of policy regarding the Armenian issue--in the current, generally positive atmosphere between Turkey and Armenia--is not clear, however. Many think that although the AKP may have been unhappy with Halacoglu's confrontational approach regarding the genocide, the party is not prepared to face off with the army nor the bureaucracy either on the Armenian issue. Therefore, no major change in its policy should be expected.

Dr. Ali Birinci, a prolific scholar called a “conservative,” “Islamist,” and nationalist” by those who know him, will replace Halacoglu. Although most commentators and researchers I spoke to say that in all likelihood Birinci will not take the TTK in a completely new direction--at least as far as the Armenian issue is concerned--it is expected that he will at least not employ Halacoglu's sensationalist tactics. Scholars familiar with Birinci's work consider him a serious researcher who has sometimes challenged the “established” historical knowledge in Turkey. Although Birinci does not have publications on the Armenian Genocide, one Turkish-born scholar expressed a “minute hope” that he would employ his training and experience to gradually challenge the fossilized denialist rhetoric on the genocide issue.

So what will become of Halacoglu? He will retain his position at Gazi University and probably continue publishing works on what he calls the “alleged Armenian genocide.” There are a few--very few--scholars who believe that recently Halacoglu, having realized how untenable his position was, had begun to work on publishing more credible research and to venture into what one scholar called “constructive cooperation” with researchers who acknowledge the genocide. Judging from the experiences of Gaunt and Sarafian, however, this sounds highly unlikely. Yet if he was, indeed, contemplating a fresh start, it is never too late. Either way, we have not heard the last from Yusuf hoca, who kept the Turkish--and, to a lesser extent, Armenian--media busy for years.

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[Sari Galin]

Caucasus closer to launching Iron Silk Road

Turkish, Azerbaijani and Georgian leaders gathered in the far eastern province of Kars on Thursday to launch the construction of the Turkey section of a railway that will link the three countries and revive the historic Silk Road trade route that once connected Asia with Europe.

President Abdullah Gül and his Azerbaijani and Georgian counterparts, Ilham Aliyev and Mikheil Saakashvili, held a groundbreaking ceremony for the $241 million Turkish leg of the railway in Kars. The three presidents placed three sections of railway track on a large map of the region in a symbolic launch of the project amid confetti. "A new economic cooperation zone which is yet to be defined as such has emerged in our region," Gül said in an address at the ceremony, referring to expanding cooperation between Turkey, Azerbaijan and Georgia in the energy, trade and transportation fields.

The three countries are linked by the Baku-Tbilisi-Ceyhan (BTC) oil pipeline, which carries crude oil from Azerbaijan's Shah Deniz oil fields to world markets through Turkey's Mediterranean port of Ceyhan, and the Baku-Tbilisi-Erzurum (BTE) gas line, but trade links between Turkey and the Caucasus region are limited.

The construction of the railway is planned to be completed by 2011. The Turkish section of the railway is 76 kilometers long. In Azerbaijan, a new track will be constructed to be linked to a renewed existing track. Work on the 29-kilometer stretch in Georgia between the Turkish border and Akhalkalaki (Ahılkelek) was launched last year. "This project contributes to the peace and stability in the Caucasus," Gül also said. Visibly absent from the project is Armenia, which has territorial and other disputes with both Turkey and Azerbaijan.

Gül said the project was open to all countries, provided that they also contribute to the peace and stability in the Caucasus and are willing to maintain good neighborly relations with other countries in the region. Turkey closed its border and severed its ties with neighboring Armenia in protest of Armenian occupation of the Azerbaijani territory of Nagorno-Karabakh early in the last decade. The landlocked country is also excluded from regional oil and natural gas transportation projects through the BTC and BTE pipelines.

The construction of the railway between Turkey, Azerbaijan and Georgia has long been hampered by Armenian lobbying against the project in the United States and Russia. Armenian experts have argued in the past that the project will not be economically viable, and the Armenian lobby pushed for a bill in the US Congress that blocked US banks from providing loans to Georgia to be used in the construction of the railway's Georgian section. The obstacles were eventually overcome by Azerbaijan offering a $220 million loan to Georgia.

Armenian leaders say the plan deliberately ignores the old rail link between Armenia and Turkey, which has been idle since the two countries cut off diplomatic ties in 1993. In March, Armenian President Serzh Sarksyan said the project did not target Armenia because many Armenian nationals were already traveling to Turkey via Georgia. The construction of the railway, he said, will further facilitate Armenians' travel to Turkey.

Gül said there was strong political will behind the project and that it will not be weakened because it will benefit the peoples of the region. Mitat Çelikpala of the private Turkish Union of Chambers and Commodity Exchanges (TOBB) Economy and Technology University said the project had been delayed for three to four years due to Armenian objections and that construction would never have started if Turkey had not pressed for it so enthusiastically, as the project had no backing from the West. According to Çelikpala, the railway will boost Turkish influence in the Caucasus and Central Asia. "The realization of this project means we will be more influential in the Caucasus, Central Asia and the Caspian region," he told the Anatolia news agency. "Turkey has become a sort of center of attraction for the entire Caucasus," he added.

The railway will also deepen ties between Georgia and Turkey, Çelikpala said, describing Turkey as the main bridge for the former Soviet Union country to economically integrate with the West.

"Some had called it a dream. It was once shelved. But meetings took place between the three countries and political will materialized to build the railway. The three countries also received support from Kazakhstan and China," Gül said at the ceremony. "Today, we are taking another step to make the historic Silk Road that people used to cross on the backs of animals a reality. This link not only connects the three countries, it also links China with London."

Transportation Minister Binali Yıldırım said the railway links from the region will extend into Europe with the completion of an ongoing rail tunnel project linking the European and Asian sides of Turkey's biggest city, İstanbul. The rail tunnel project, called Marmaray, is planned to be completed in 2013. "Thanks to this project, we will not just be a part of Europe, we will become a solid bridge between Europe and Asia," Saakashvili said.

Aliyev: Cooperation deepens

Azerbaijani President Aliyev said his country had excellent relations with both Turkey and Georgia. "The people are also getting closer as their countries launch joint projects," he said at the ceremony. He called the BTC oil pipeline a "dream come true" and added that the cooperation will be further strengthened when the railway becomes operational.

Some 1.5 million people and 6.5 million tons of cargo are expected to be transported by the railway in the first year following its launch.

Railway project in figures

The Baku-Tbilisi-Kars railway project is built on links forged by natural gas and oil pipelines between Turkey, Azerbaijan and Georgia. The Turkish stretch will consist of a 76-kilometer railway. The Özgün Yapı-Çelikler joint venture won the tender last September for construction of the Turkish leg with a bid of YTL 289.8 million ($241 million), the lowest among 14 bids. In Azerbaijan, the project involves the laying of new track and the renewal of existing rails. Work on the 29-kilometer stretch in Georgia between the Turkish border and Akhalkalaki (Ahılkelek) began last year. The project is expected to be launched in 2011, with an initial capacity to carry 1.5 million people and 6.5 million tons of cargo annually. Its capacity is projected to grow to 3 million people and 17 million tons of cargo by 2034. The project's cost is estimated at $450 million.

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Time for Armenia to take action to avoid isolation, says expert

A project to launch a railway between Turkey, Azerbaijan and Georgia is a strong message to Armenia that it has to take action to avoid isolation in the region, an expert has said.

"Armenia is about to be pushed into permanent isolation," said Hasan Kanbolat, an expert at the Ankara-based Center for Eurasian Strategic Studies (ASAM). He said Turkey was the main outlet for the landlocked Armenia to reach the West and that Yerevan must take concrete steps to normalize its relations with Ankara.

Turkey closed its border and severed its diplomatic ties with Armenia in the '90s in protest of Armenia's occupation of Nagorno-Karabakh in Azerbaijan. Ankara says normalization of ties depends on Armenian withdrawal from Nagorno-Karabakh, a change of policy in Yerevan on its claims of "genocide" against Armenians by Ottomans during World War I and formal recognition of the Turkish-Armenian border by Armenia.

Armenia has recently stepped up calls for normalization of ties with Turkey. Armenian President Serzh Sarksyan said earlier this month that he had invited his Turkish counterpart, Abdullah Gül, to visit Yerevan and watch a football match in September.

Kanbolat, however, said the invitation was not enough and that more substantial steps were needed for any serious progress in the direction of normalization to take place. "Armenia should keep its promises regarding gradual withdrawal from Azerbaijani territory," he told Today's Zaman. Turkish and Armenian officials had secret talks on July 8 in Switzerland, but the Turkish Foreign Ministry said this does not indicate a change of a policy.

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[Sari Galin]

Controversial historian dismissed from office

FULYA ÖZERKAN

ANKARA – Turkish Daily News

The head of the Turkish Historical Society was dismissed from his post yesterday, a development whose timing coincides with the government's steps toward a rapprochement with Armenia.

I don't know why … I got the news while on holiday, Professor Yusuf Halaçoğlu told the Turkish Daily News in a telephone interview. It is not a big deal to be president of the Turkish Historical Society; I am a historian.

The dismissal of Halaçoğlu, known to be a hardliner on the Armenian question, came at a time when diplomatic negotiations are underway to normalize relations between Turkey and Armenia, which currently have no diplomatic ties.

Halaçoğlu said, however, that he did not believe his removal from office was linked to the recent developments. I don't think so. I'm not averse to dialogue (with Armenia). Indeed, Dashnaks were going to meet with me in September. I'm not a person who is averse to dialogue with anybody, he said.

Halaçoğlu's occasional statements on the Armenian question often escalated tension. Kurds who live in Turkey are originally descendents of Turkmens, and Kurdish Alevis are originally Armenian, Halaçoğlu said once, irking Alevi institutions and pro-Kurdish politicians, who demanded his resignation and accusing him of racism.

No official announcement has been made yet of a successor for Halaçoğlu, who will continue to work as a professor at Ankara's Gazi University. News reporters suggested yesterday that Professor Ali Birinci would replace him. Contacted by the TDN, Birinci said he was not officially informed of such a decision.

Dialogue must resolve differences'

Commenting on the present opening of the Turkish government towards Armenia through secret talks that were later confirmed by the foreign minister, Halaçoğlu said that, in his opinion as a historian, no problem can be resolved without dialogue.

Halaçoğlu described Armenia as a landlocked country suffering from socio-economic problems, which needs Turkey to open up to the world.

Armenia cannot go out without Turkey. Turkey is a big country where close to 70,000 illegal immigrants from Armenia are working to earn their living. Armenia cannot survive in the Caucasus by excluding Turkey, he added.

Asked why the talks between the two sides were secret, Halaçoğlu said Armenia could not conduct talks publicly because of pressure from the Armenian diaspora and hardliners inside the country.

He said a football game between the two countries' national teams set for September could be a good beginning for further reconciliation. Armenian President Serzh Sarksyan has invited his Turkish counterpart to visit Yerevan for the football match in September, marking a shift in relations between the two states.

Maybe this will be an opportunity for a meeting for the two countries' presidents to resolve their differences. This is a political game. Actually, the Turkish-Armenian issue is not scientific; it is a politicized matter, he added.

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[ZINVOR]

А никто из вас не допускает что это может быть генеральный экзамен для.....Армянства в целом?

[Semetoja]

А никто из вас не допускает что это может быть генеральный экзамен для.....Армянства в целом?